At the IWC Tournament i had was a little issue.

It seems that for instance a Legendary General becomes a 4 card general if he gets wounded.

In the claries it is said that a Legendary general can be killed once he gets wounded as he becomes a 4 card general.

There is a problem in the wording in the rules.

basically there are 4 types of generals : legendary, talented , competent, mediocre

in the rules there are no 5 card/4 card etc Generals.

For me : "a Legendary general can be killed once he gets wounded as he becomes a 4 card general." Means : a legendary general stays legendary but only has 4 cards

someone also told me that when a legendary general gets wounded :

- he loses his legendary bonus but keeps his command radius as legendary

this all is a bit confusing and i could not find this anywhere.

why speaking about the quality of generals and then talk about x-card general ?

It goes against the kiss principle :

Legendary gets wounded, becomes talented and so on. Not legendary becomes 4 card general which brings confusion.

also in the rules there bits and pieces about the generals  in different chapters. there is not one chapter that tells everything about the generals. You have to slalom through the rules.

Also i been told the claries of 2018 are still valid but only in part if not amended by new claries...even if the old ones are not available anymore ?

...still love the rules and i had great games today at IWC with my British counterparts

I would certainly hope that this confusion has been addressed in the new compendium.

A legendary general who is wounded is reduced to 4 cards.
A 4-card general (wounded legendary or a talented) who is wounded is reduced to 3 cards
A 3-card general (twice-wounded legendary, wounded talented or a competent) who is wounded is reduced to 2 cards.
A 2-card general (three-times wounded legendary, twice-wounded talented, wounded competent or a mediocre) loses their cards, but remains a 2-card general.

Question for Simon - does a wounded legendary general fight at +2 or +1 in combat?  (I have may have answered this incorrectly yesterday when I was asked).

Further question:   Can a floating C-in-C fight in the front-rank of a melee and still dish out cards.   I answered this by saying yes. I believe this has been asked before on the forum.  The rationale is that the floating capability represents how the army is set up prior to the battle rather than relying on the individual himself.  (Julius Caesar at the Battle of the Sambre is the historical example).

p.s.  Thanks to everyone taking part in the IWC yesterday.  The games seem to have been played in a very good spirit. A few players get a bit passionate when arguing about the rules - they need to remember that once the Umpire has ruled they need to move on.  Well done to Jacques for umpiring.

Richard

Quote from: lionheartrjc on January 20, 2020, 08:54:33 AM
Further question:   Can a floating C-in-C fight in the front-rank of a melee and still dish out cards.   I answered this by saying yes. I believe this has been asked before on the forum.  The rationale is that the floating capability represents how the army is set up prior to the battle rather than relying on the individual himself.  (Julius Caesar at the Battle of the Sambre is the historical example).

From the draft compendium:

"They can float behind the lines, commanding no troops directly and using their cards to support their professional non-allied sub-generals. This is done by gifting any or all of their cards to any such general within 15BW during the card phase (SP1.3). They lose this ability when in combat as all generals and UGs they are not with are out of command."

Caesar at the Sambre could be argued either way - whilst he takes up a shield it never (IIRC) says he actually fights, only that he goes and sorts out the disorder in the ranks (which in MeG terms may just be removing a wound?).

We have always played that when wounded, a generals goes down one level ...so to me legendary goes to talented goes to competent goes to mediocre and mediocre to mediocre 

So wounded legendary becomes talented and talented is +1 with 4 cards

But at IWC nobody asked me the question

Another point was submitted to me :

My general is in a file .
The file is caught on the flank and 2 bases will be assaulted .
The player argued that as both bases were in the same file, he could give bonus to both combat .
My decision was that he had to choose as IMO a general gives his bonus to ONE die roll when in combat.

But that might need a small line in the rules ( if I am correct )

Quote from: nikgaukroger on January 20, 2020, 09:25:59 AM

Quote from: lionheartrjc on January 20, 2020, 08:54:33 AM
Further question:   Can a floating C-in-C fight in the front-rank of a melee and still dish out cards.   I answered this by saying yes. I believe this has been asked before on the forum.  The rationale is that the floating capability represents how the army is set up prior to the battle rather than relying on the individual himself.  (Julius Caesar at the Battle of the Sambre is the historical example).

From the draft compendium:

"They can float behind the lines, commanding no troops directly and using their cards to support their professional non-allied sub-generals. This is done by gifting any or all of their cards to any such general within 15BW during the card phase (SP1.3). They lose this ability when in combat as all generals and UGs they are not with are out of command."

Caesar at the Sambre could be argued either way - whilst he takes up a shield it never (IIRC) says he actually fights, only that he goes and sorts out the disorder in the ranks (which in MeG terms may just be removing a wound?).

Thanks Nik - so cannot float to gift cards and fight at the same time...

What about the rule : out of command you need to play another supplementary colored card to give a command

Giving a command isn't the same as gifting.

Quote from: badhabum on January 20, 2020, 01:04:47 PM
Another point was submitted to me :

My general is in a file .
The file is caught on the flank and 2 bases will be assaulted .
The player argued that as both bases were in the same file, he could give bonus to both combat .
My decision was that he had to choose as IMO a general gives his bonus to ONE die roll when in combat.

But that might need a small line in the rules ( if I am correct )

A classic bit of cheese.  This has already been answered on the forum.  A general can only give his combat bonus once in any phase.  If the file was already in combat, he can only give the bonus to the front base in the file.  If the file wasn't already in combat, he can choose which base to fight with. 

Note:  Generals in combat can play a green card (or white upgraded) to move between files within the same UG.  They do not have to take a snivelling little coward KAB test as long as they keep fighting in a front rank file.

Richard

Quote from: lionheartrjc on January 20, 2020, 01:05:46 PM

Quote from: nikgaukroger on January 20, 2020, 09:25:59 AM

Quote from: lionheartrjc on January 20, 2020, 08:54:33 AM
Further question:   Can a floating C-in-C fight in the front-rank of a melee and still dish out cards.   I answered this by saying yes. I believe this has been asked before on the forum.  The rationale is that the floating capability represents how the army is set up prior to the battle rather than relying on the individual himself.  (Julius Caesar at the Battle of the Sambre is the historical example).

From the draft compendium:

"They can float behind the lines, commanding no troops directly and using their cards to support their professional non-allied sub-generals. This is done by gifting any or all of their cards to any such general within 15BW during the card phase (SP1.3). They lose this ability when in combat as all generals and UGs they are not with are out of command."

Caesar at the Sambre could be argued either way - whilst he takes up a shield it never (IIRC) says he actually fights, only that he goes and sorts out the disorder in the ranks (which in MeG terms may just be removing a wound?).

Thanks Nik - so cannot float to gift cards and fight at the same time...

You can float , fight and give card IF the receiver commander is attached to the very same unit.
It has been clarified in the past

Quote from: badhabum on January 20, 2020, 01:01:28 PM
We have always played that when wounded, a generals goes down one level ...so to me legendary goes to talented goes to competent goes to mediocre and mediocre to mediocre 

So wounded legendary becomes talented and talented is +1 with 4 cards

But at IWC nobody asked me the question

Then why would you suffer a KAB with a double minus (cdt in chief + legendary) when he dies.
You cannot die on a KAB with a legendary. With 5 cards.

My understanding is that a legendary remain a legendary even when it drops to 2 card general.
This is why they made the distinction between general type and the number of cards

Quote from: Rino on January 20, 2020, 01:30:09 PM

You can float , fight and give card IF the receiver commander is attached to the very same unit.
It has been clarified in the past

The upcoming Compendium clearly states (assuming no changes from the draft I have) that you cannot gift if in combat - no exceptions are given. This may be a slight change to how it has been ruled in the past.

I let my opponent keep his +2 for a Legendary General when I knocked him down to Talented.  I couldn't find the answer in the paperwork.

Quote from: rayfredjohn on January 20, 2020, 02:31:04 PM
I let my opponent keep his +2 for a Legendary General when I knocked him down to Talented.  I couldn't find the answer in the paperwork.

I've only just started playing, but I would have thought 9.1 D:5 (although I think it should be 3. - Page 54) "A Sword&Arrow symbol injures a general - he permanently drops a level down (to a minimum of Mediocre) but keeps any cards he is holding." indicates he is no longer "Legendary" and permanently "Talented" therefore loses the +2? 

Quote from: Bru on January 20, 2020, 05:08:16 PM

Quote from: rayfredjohn on January 20, 2020, 02:31:04 PM
I let my opponent keep his +2 for a Legendary General when I knocked him down to Talented.  I couldn't find the answer in the paperwork.

I've only just started playing, but I would have thought 9.1 D:5 (although I think it should be 3. - Page 54) "A Sword&Arrow symbol injures a general - he permanently drops a level down (to a minimum of Mediocre) but keeps any cards he is holding." indicates he is no longer "Legendary" and permanently "Talented" therefore loses the +2? 

The UK Tournament Umpire

Quote from: lionheartrjc on January 20, 2020, 08:54:33 AM
I would certainly hope that this confusion has been addressed in the new compendium.

A legendary general who is wounded is reduced to 4 cards.
A 4-card general (wounded legendary or a talented) who is wounded is reduced to 3 cards
A 3-card general (twice-wounded legendary, wounded talented or a competent) who is wounded is reduced to 2 cards.
A 2-card general (three-times wounded legendary, twice-wounded talented, wounded competent or a mediocre) loses their cards, but remains a 2-card general.

Question for Simon - does a wounded legendary general fight at +2 or +1 in combat?  (I have may have answered this incorrectly yesterday when I was asked).

Further question:   Can a floating C-in-C fight in the front-rank of a melee and still dish out cards.   I answered this by saying yes. I believe this has been asked before on the forum.  The rationale is that the floating capability represents how the army is set up prior to the battle rather than relying on the individual himself.  (Julius Caesar at the Battle of the Sambre is the historical example).

p.s.  Thanks to everyone taking part in the IWC yesterday.  The games seem to have been played in a very good spirit. A few players get a bit passionate when arguing about the rules - they need to remember that once the Umpire has ruled they need to move on.  Well done to Jacques for umpiring.

Richard