Orckind

[Simon Meg-Meister]

Slide7 by Simon Hall, on Flickr

[Lanceflint]

OK, my take on the Third Age would be:

Goblins - quite a lot, say 50% Unprotected, remainder Protected. Tribal, Loose, Devastating Charger, Combat Shy. Optional Integral Shooters. Archers as Unprotected. Great Goblins - Formed, Loose, Average, Protected, Devastating Charger. Optional Melee Expert and/or Integral Shooters.

Saurons Orcs - Tribal, Loose, Protected, Devastating Charger. Optional Combat Shy and/or Integral shooters. Archers same bur with bow.

Uruks  - Formed Loose, Protected, Superior, Devastating Charger, Shove. Optional Integral Shooter and/or Melee Expert.
Otherwise vs Rohan equip with Long Spear but no Melee Expert.

Remember that all troops can be lowered one morale level and one shooting level. Beware of making troops too good!
Lance.

[Simon Meg-Meister]

I like that as a vs2 pretty universally thanks.

Si

[Lanceflint]

Thats good to hear. Will do some points comparisons too.
You really cant have enough Orcs!
Lance.

[conjunctio]

OK, my take on the Third Age would be:

Goblins - quite a lot, say 50% Unprotected, remainder Protected. Tribal, Loose, Devastating Charger, Combat Shy. Optional Integral Shooters. Archers as Unprotected. Great Goblins - Formed, Loose, Average, Protected, Devastating Charger. Optional Melee Expert and/or Integral Shooters.

Saurons Orcs - Tribal, Loose, Protected, Devastating Charger. Optional Combat Shy and/or Integral shooters. Archers same bur with bow.

Uruks  - Formed Loose, Protected, Superior, Devastating Charger, Shove. Optional Integral Shooter and/or Melee Expert.
Otherwise vs Rohan equip with Long Spear but no Melee Expert.

Remember that all troops can be lowered one morale level and one shooting level. Beware of making troops too good!
Lance.

Nicely set out... I think the tribal 'type' reflects the Goblins without a top evil leader that turns them into more of a cohesive and coordinated and disciplined threat or the more disposable support troops for the less battle specific Tactical unit Group work. The barbaric hordes menacing states out in the borderlands of the more civilised cultures. Hit and run tactics/strategy.

The development to more organised, battle worthy types of formed or drilled comes from the will of some overlord like Morgoth, Glaurung, Sauron, Saruman, Gothmog etc. Generally the majority of Orcs (Goblins especially/Snaga) are weaker or smaller than their human and Elvish counterparts but present in far greater numbers at major battles. In other army lists they are described as winning usually by wearing the enemy down or outflanking them (in Tolkien canon). Where they lost it was often due to losing critical command figures (so maybe a downgrade of some especially potent leader like the Witch King - Drilled go down to tribal). They also suffered with inter-tribal rivalries, which only seem offset by the will of powerful overlords. There is something distinctly 'Gaulish' about Orc warfare and the ability to wage it. Numberless hordes. Except from the various battles described across the canon they're rarely prone to impetuous behaviour (in one battle this is the case for the Elves not orcs), usually armed with swords, scimitars, axes and spears with descent armour and close support from archers. They move swiftly when motivated , operated effectively in rough terrain and could resist strongly. They were usually not a match for well-disciplined opponents

[Lanceflint]

So for a  game:
The basic Goblin warrior comes in at 24 pts a base, as Unprotected,
The basic Orc at 60, because he is protected and not combat shy,
Whilst the Fighting Uruk-hai, if Superior and Melee Expert are 120 points.
Which all sounds quite reasonable unless you are facing an Uruk- Hai charge head on

I think the basic points system will transfer very nicely.
Lance.

[Simon Meg-Meister]

Yes that feel nice as an initial balance.

S