if a unit of 6 Spartans with Orb Characteristic looses a base due to shooting does it also loose its ability to form orb? or does formation adapt as below


[attachment deleted by admin]

No it's stuck unless it contracts.
Viewed to not have enough men to form a square - too thinly spread.
So to be safe to do so start 3-deep 2-wide.

Si

Ok
1. So if the unit starts in orb the orb disintegrate when it looses a base???
               or/and
2. When it looses another base to shooting it will regain its ability to form orb!!! 
3. Surely the process of forming and maintaining an Orb
    a. is not just an about-turn but contracting and adjusting ranks to form an Orb
    b. contracting and reforming to accommodate losses
4. if a 90 degree turn will allow you to reform your front rank facing the new direction with troops that were not on that flank, the rational being the base represent brigades etc. why would an Orb commander not reorder his brigade in a Orb

Don't do it Roger.

Don't take Spartan to the IWC 

Ray is correct. A Spartan who has to go into Orb has already lost. Snatch the pebble from my hand, Grasshopper.

Quote from: Roger on December 25, 2019, 10:46:24 AM
Ok
1. So if the unit starts in orb the orb disintegrate when it looses a base???
               or/and
2. When it looses another base to shooting it will regain its ability to form orb!!! 
3. Surely the process of forming and maintaining an Orb
    a. is not just an about-turn but contracting and adjusting ranks to form an Orb
    b. contracting and reforming to accommodate losses
4. if a 90 degree turn will allow you to reform your front rank facing the new direction with troops that were not on that flank, the rational being the base represent brigades etc. why would an Orb commander not reorder his brigade in a Orb

Orbs were not easy to form we suspect.  And it's all an abstraction.

Its 2 ranks deep to form it.  After that its' taken that the ranks adjust as you say.  So once in it you are in it however few you have left ... think last stand of Leonidas at Themopylae.

Thanks for that Si, at least i understand the rule even if the practice is counter intuitive!

"a unit of 8 can form orb, it looses a base it now can't , however when it looses 25 % of its forces it could , it looses another base it can't , it comes down to 50% it can "

Quote from: Roger on December 26, 2019, 11:09:08 AM
Thanks for that Si, at least i understand the rule even if the practice is counter intuitive!

"a unit of 8 can form orb, it looses a base it now can't , however when it looses 25 % of its forces it could , it looses another base it can't , it comes down to 50% it can "

Indeed.  So the abstraction forces the right feel which is a deeper formation than 8 ranks if you want to do it safely.  Remember that 1 rank deep is just 4 men deep.  Too few to make a rank in each direction have any resilience.  So theban 4 deep spears more the ideal in reality.  What we don't want in game terms is people doing 8-wide single-rank spartans and forming OrB to block 1/6th of the table.

The rules have to avoid laws of unintended consquences.

S

Quote from: Simon Meg-Meister on December 27, 2019, 06:45:43 AM
The rules have to avoid laws of untented consquences.

Yes they definitely must have tents or some other form of shelter

Quote from: Simon Meg-Meister on December 25, 2019, 08:07:45 PM

Quote from: Roger on December 25, 2019, 10:46:24 AM
Ok
1. So if the unit starts in orb the orb disintegrate when it looses a base???
               or/and
2. When it looses another base to shooting it will regain its ability to form orb!!! 
3. Surely the process of forming and maintaining an Orb
    a. is not just an about-turn but contracting and adjusting ranks to form an Orb
    b. contracting and reforming to accommodate losses
4. if a 90 degree turn will allow you to reform your front rank facing the new direction with troops that were not on that flank, the rational being the base represent brigades etc. why would an Orb commander not reorder his brigade in a Orb

Orbs were not easy to form we suspect.  And it's all an abstraction.

Its 2 ranks deep to form it.  After that its' taken that the ranks adjust as you say.  So once in it you are in it however few you have left ... think last stand of Leonidas at Themopylae.

Might need to put it in the claries.

As the Orb is degraded does the odd base left fold back acrosss the files to keep some semblance of Orb? as in the diagram attached

[attachment deleted by admin]

Its all too much effortful such a niche concept.
Essentially the reasoning is if you are 12 the orb is pretty solid.
8 deep just about doable.
4 deep no use.

If we wanted to make it more big reform it >=4BW from enemy.

Quote from: Simon Meg-Meister on December 28, 2019, 08:30:07 AM
Its all too much effortful such a niche concept.
Essentially the reasoning is if you are 12 the orb is pretty solid.
8 deep just about doable.
4 deep no use.

If we wanted to make it more big reform it >=4BW from enemy.

no Use compared to a flank  charge?...i am not so sure...you could hold a crucial round

Sorry Jilu ... I meant complexifiyng the rules further is too much.

Orb cab be really handy in the right army and buy you 1-2 turns when needed.

S

Up to now, no spartans at IWC ...if the people want some I might play that army but refuses to die at the end