Two questions arose from yesterday's game:

1. Allied command desertion rule 4.2 on p.95 states if they draw all BLACK cards at any time including the first draw they suffer desertion. The question was whether this applies to all allies at any time during the game or just when hesitant? If it only applies when hesitant it doesn't state that is so and if it is why isn't it listed in the following rule 5 below which lists the effects of being hesitant; consequently we decided it applies to all allies at any time as stated. Is this the intention?

2. A SUG was charged in the flank by another SUG in mountains. The owning player decided to skirmish away even though he couldn't shoot against the chargers and then rolled a one on the die on the vmd table so ended up not moving. The question arose should they be allowed to turn to flank as per rule 4.5.2 on p.128 which says "it does at least turn around to face them" or do they have to stay where they are per rule 3.2 on p.127 and be charged in the flank? We decided on the latter but were we right?

Having pondered my first point further I think it is answered in the definition of desertion on p215.

I would still be interested in hearing any views on point 2.

Off the top of my head I can't see why they wouldn't have the option to turn. They move 0BW and then can turn 

Quote from: nikgaukroger on January 15, 2021, 03:15:20 PM
Off the top of my head I can't see why they wouldn't have the option to turn. They move 0BW and then can turn 

Don't agree with your response Nik - one of us is probably misunderstanding the situation.

If the unit is skirmishing or running away it has three options, to skirmish forwards (no turn), skirmish to it's rear (turn 180) or turn and wheel directly away from the charge.  The last option (to wheel) is not possible if you have 0BW movement - turns are free but wheels need movement.  The other options remain possible.  So depending upon the location of the enemy, it may be possible to avoid a flank charge by choosing to turn or not.

What they cannot do in the charge phase is turn to flank to face the unit that is charging them to avoid the flank charge.  It is possible that a turn away from the charge might get them out of charge range even without moving any further.

Richard

I think you are forgetting section 4.5 on page 128, specifically 4.5.2 - or I've misunderstood something here 

4.5 is about the troops facing after a run-away or skirmish move and 4.5.2 says - "Facing towards the charge if a skirmish response. If you choose to skirmish when charged in the flank or rear your shooting is deemed ineffective and you roll no shooting dice, but it does at least turn you around to face them."

Indeed. Quite right.  Should have pointed out that skirmishers turn after making the move.

Richard.

OK they turn at the end of the move but if due to die roll the move is 0 ..why would the TUG/SK not turn ? It is not stated that the unit must mlake a minimum distance move . Or is there something I miss

Quote from: badhabum on January 18, 2021, 10:08:34 AM
OK they turn at the end of the move but if due to die roll the move is 0 ..why would the TUG/SK not turn ? It is not stated that the unit must mlake a minimum distance move . Or is there something I miss

The UG would turn.  It can turn if the move is 0, it just can't wheel.

Richard

Thanks for the clarification. So it seems SUGs charged in flank can always turn to face if they choose the skirmish option no matter what they roll on the vmd table.

Flanks aren't really an issue for a bunch of skirmishers unless already pinned in melee.  It is not as if they would have maintained a rigid formation.
Richard

Quote from: lionheartrjc on January 18, 2021, 01:00:43 PM

Quote from: badhabum on January 18, 2021, 10:08:34 AM
OK they turn at the end of the move but if due to die roll the move is 0 ..why would the TUG/SK not turn ? It is not stated that the unit must mlake a minimum distance move . Or is there something I miss

The UG would turn.  It can turn if the move is 0, it just can't wheel.

Richard

Thank you