mixed Tugs Asian lists

[Raiderd]

  Just curious  no more mixed  1/2 polearm 1/2 shooter Tugs         Why the change ?

[martymagnificent]

Quite a few lists have lost mixed units of various types

Martin

[lionheartrjc]

  Just curious  no more mixed  1/2 polearm 1/2 shooter Tugs         Why the change ?

You need to be slightly more specific, but we did remove a lot of mixed TuGs from the later Han period because frankly there is no evidence for them being used.  Even in the earlier Han period they are more of an exception to deal with nomads. 

The later Tang/early Song formations were modified in line with Nik Gaukroger's suggestions on the forum.

Chinese sources are difficult, not least because the Chinese didn't write history for wargamers so they don't focus on the things we want to know...

Richard

[AntiokosIII]

A club member of ours was wondering about why these troops were no longer included in the Choseon Korean list. I told the guy that my ignorance of Korean military  history was so vast it defied accurate measurement. I suspect that's what Dale was asking about.  The troop type does seem to have been the subject of a fairly general purge, though. Does evidence for them that used to be acceptable now look weak, or is it a play balance thing? I'm asking for a friend.

[lionheartrjc]

Koreans.  Well, I won't claim any expertise on Korean armies.  I could only find one source for mixed units and that was a wargamer, not an academic.  All the other sources I could find (not a huge number admittedly) made no mention of mixed units.

If anyone has access to really good source material on Korean armies I would be really interested.

Richard

[AntiokosIII]

It often comes down to how much guesswork and supposition one is comfortable with. Frequently, academic sources just don't care about weapons, armor, and formations like gamers do.

[martymagnificent]

A club member of ours was wondering about why these troops were no longer included in the Choseon Korean list. I told the guy that my ignorance of Korean military  history was so vast it defied accurate measurement. I suspect that's what Dale was asking about.  The troop type does seem to have been the subject of a fairly general purge, though. Does evidence for them that used to be acceptable now look weak, or is it a play balance thing? I'm asking for a friend.

Couldn't be a play balance thing. Most of these armies have barely ever been played. In mixed units the infantry is OK, in separate a lot of it is probably a liability (varying on which list you are thinking of).

Martin

[Simon Meg-Meister]

It changes them a fair bit.
You get to use pole arm UGs that are stronger in combat but your missile troops need more careful management.

Si

[nikgaukroger]

Koreans.  Well, I won't claim any expertise on Korean armies.  I could only find one source for mixed units and that was a wargamer, not an academic.  All the other sources I could find (not a huge number admittedly) made no mention of mixed units.

If anyone has access to really good source material on Korean armies I would be really interested.

Richard

Can't say I've ever looked that much but there does seem to be a dearth of info in English - for all I know there could be loads in Korean or Chinese, but that is way beyond my ability.