Elephant Bows

[Hunter]

Do Angkhor Empire Elephants with bow shoot at 4 BWs or 3BWs?   As I understand it the argument for 4 is that the shooting mainly comes from foot bowmen escorting the nellies.

[Simon Meg-Meister]

3BW as Elephants are mounted.  Keeps it simple.
And not that easy shooting between Elephants vs normal fire.

S

[Hunter]

Many thanks Si.   I couldn't see anything in the rules for 4 and figured that if bronze age firing platforms - chariots - weren't 4 then why would nellies be.   Someone reading an extra line into the rules maybe?
HH

[AntiokosIII]

I agree that this is the rule, and that it’s simpler to make all mounted shooting ranges the same. I do not really support changing it. Simple is good.
I have long wondered, though, why rules sets assume that riding in a relatively stable Howdah would cut shooting ranges as much as riding a galloping horse. I suppose there is no way to test this, but I’ve always wondered. Wasn’t the tower/howdah invented to allow for more crew and give them a stable platform?

[Simon Meg-Meister]

Have you ever ridden a moving Elephant
Had a go in Sri Lanka.
I think I'd describe it as strong, rather than stable.

It's much ore difficult to do anything than when standing.

Si

[AntiokosIII]

Yes, I have ridden elephants! I have a son with autism. When he was around 8, he became rather obsessed with elephants. There’s a wild animal park not far from where we live that featured elephant rides, either bareback or on a platform. We went there a LOT, and some days (autistic kids being fond of repeating things they like) we rode the elephant over and over for hours.

We rode several different animals, all female Indian Ellie’s. My impression was that while their gait had a distinct roll to it, it was very steady and regular. My impression was that a person could easily become accustomed to it enough to allow for using missile weapons pretty much as if on the ground. It was that steady.

I emphasize that I do not want the rule changed; I was just wondering aloud whether our assumptions are correct. My experience would emphatically NOT be a valid basis for a rule change. For one thing, I am a crap archer whether on the ground or on elephant back!

[badhabum]

Did you try under battlestress ? 

Might be a bit different

[martymagnificent]

Not sure I would ever willingly pay for bow on an elephant. I tend to feel they should be charging. Maybe if they were shoot and charge.

Martin

[AntiokosIII]

I originally agreed with you, Marty, but after playing Burmese awhile I changed my mind. There are times when you want to induce the enemy to charge you, not the other way ‘round. This is mostly when facing drilled close foot or any loose foot. You really want that extra +1 on the charge for having the foot charge you when going in with a mere +2. If you shoot, you not only can’t be forced to charge, you start throwing a few white dice at the enemy every turn, often helping to force him into action. Personally, I think it is worth the extra points, but I admit it’s a close call.

When you rely on elephants for a big portion of your shock power, they really have to win on the charge, or you’re toast. Steps you can take to make that more likely are worth taking, IMHO. SHooting can help that a lot. It does cost cards, though.

[Simon Meg-Meister]

Yes, I have ridden elephants! I have a son with autism. When he was around 8, he became rather obsessed with elephants. There’s a wild animal park not far from where we live that featured elephant rides, either bareback or on a platform. We went there a LOT, and some days (autistic kids being fond of repeating things they like) we rode the elephant over and over for hours.

We rode several different animals, all female Indian Ellie’s. My impression was that while their gait had a distinct roll to it, it was very steady and regular. My impression was that a person could easily become accustomed to it enough to allow for using missile weapons pretty much as if on the ground. It was that steady.

I emphasize that I do not want the rule changed; I was just wondering aloud whether our assumptions are correct. My experience would emphatically NOT be a valid basis for a rule change. For one thing, I am a crap archer whether on the ground or on elephant back!

I found them ok walking but once speeded up .... much worse than a horse.

[marshalney2000]

With elephants are not a lot of the supporting archers on foot rather than on the elephant.

[Simon Meg-Meister]

Bit of both.  Best ones have accompanying archers and lots of riders.
Shooting past elephnats aint so easy though when intermingled.
Nowhere near as easy as a clear view.
They make quite an obstacle.

Si