The 2020 MeG Compendium ... your input welcome

[Simon Meg-Meister]

From discussions we had at Britcon , on the continent we would like to have a real stability. Even a UK player discussed with me the feeling we had to have new army lists or rule changes from one tournament to another. We would like to stick to what is written so write it well because we loose players that do not want to play MEG anymore.

Some of the points

May a unit that made a skirmish shoot during the shooting phase if it did not have the opportunity during charge phase . The written answer is NO as written in the official 2019 clarries. The referee told me YES because it had been clarified otherwise recently . Black and White . I bowed to the referee's decision but wondered if the written rules still were useful.

Now if we stick to it, they may shoot, a unit that did make a run away will it have to shoot one color lower or will it have none of the disadvantage of having run away.

SKIRMISHING/RUNNING AWAY : the SUG/TUG may go forward/Backward or the direction of the charge. It gives such units a great maneuverability as it may move after that even limited but it is possible and by doing so be in the rear or flank of an enemy unit . A running away unit may move more than the maximum as it may move 2 MU after running away.  IMO, the unit should first try to run away from the direction of the charge. Another way to do it would be by restricting the possible moves after SK or Running away even more .

Some wanted clarifications on the path of charge. As it is written, it is the path that the unit would cover while charging so some people have difficulties with shooty units in the back that shoots at the charger that is to the front . I understand both logics but whatever the final decision will be it needs to be written black on white .

Remember, on the continent we play less tournaments and do not have direct access to Simon's input as regularly as you my dears :-)

So my first report. Will ponder for the next points .

Very conscious of both points Jacques so aiming to make minimal changes that are all positive and lock it down.  And after than we can do a French translation based on what was done in the past.  That will help I am sure and set us up to grow in France and Belgium. 

S

[badhabum]

Some of the points

May a unit that made a skirmish shoot during the shooting phase if it did not have the opportunity during charge phase . The written answer is NO as written in the official 2019 clarries. The referee told me YES because it had been clarified otherwise recently . Black and White . I bowed to the referee's decision but wondered if the written rules still were useful.

Now if we stick to it, they may shoot, a unit that did make a run away will it have to shoot one color lower or will it have none of the disadvantage of having run away.

By the way, how must it be played now : to shoot or not to shoot latter ?

[badhabum]

STILL NO ANSWER ?

[Simon Meg-Meister]

Whatever the current rules and clarries say.
But short of time to relook at present.
In uk.

Si

[lionheartrjc]

STILL NO ANSWER ?

An Umpire Ruling is NEVER definitive, even when I made it!  Umpires are fallible and particularly when trying to play their own game, do the best they can in the circumstances.
That said, I still cannot find where in the 2019 Official Clarifications (https://mortem-et-gloriam.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=210.0) it says that a unit that skirmished but did not shoot cannot shoot in the Shooting Phase.


Richard

[marshalney2000]

It would be illogical if they did not.

[nikgaukroger]

Closest is:

SKIRMISHING WHEN CHARGED FROM FLANK/REAR
• Is allowed to get a free turn if you are prepared to take the risk, but troops so doing are considered to have done a shooting action and cannot shoot in the shooting phase (they just had no real target).

[RobAustin]

And regarding this, I asked if some files of a unit shoot in the charge phase, can other files of that unit shoot in the shooting phase. Nik indicated that shooting is by file, so yes, they can. But this seems to indicate they may not be able to do so, since if they skirmish they cannot shoot.

[nikgaukroger]

The bit I quoted just now refers to a specific set of circumstances when it is unlikely/impossible that any files will have been able to shoot in the charge phase - and then they have to opt to use a free turn before they are considered to have shot, if they don't make this turn IMO nothing stops them shooting.

[nikgaukroger]

I also think that the bit I quoted is unnecessary and should be removed from the 2020 edition.

[Rino]

If we do it by files we need to leave markers to indicate which file shot already and which didn't
I thought we were not supposed to leave markers after a phase.

Kis?

[nikgaukroger]

There is no "if", shooting is by file. I've never found the need for markers for this.

[Rino]

Disregard my last message, I will  just wait for the final official version

[Simon Meg-Meister]

You shoot by file and always have done.  Never needed to ever mark that as it is always very easy to remember or even still see on the tabletop.  Must have played 500 games now and never needed to mark any of that.

Turn around when charged from rear and shoot is too dangerous.  It is quite logical methinks if you cut beyond the abstraction.  If charged, you shoot for a bit and once chargers get close you draw swords.  So if you are facing away and turn at end of move to fight you have a sword in had now.  If you were still holding the bow only believe me it would be more than +1 against on contact!

This is why I consider they have consumed their opportunity to shoot.

Easier, but more brutal would be to change skirmish to facing in original direction of facing rather than facing enemy and not allow the turn at all.

S

[badhabum]

STILL NO ANSWER ?

An Umpire Ruling is NEVER definitive, even when I made it!  Umpires are fallible and particularly when trying to play their own game, do the best they can in the circumstances.
That said, I still cannot find where in the 2019 Official Clarifications (https://mortem-et-gloriam.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=210.0) it says that a unit that skirmished but did not shoot cannot shoot in the Shooting Phase.


Richard

Hy Richard,

I did not say that an Umpire cannot make mistakes . But as you told me that it had been recently clarified I searched . If you follow the link you provide you will find this on the PDF document ( pg 8-9 MEG TEMP CLARIES )  :

SKIRMISHING   WHEN   CHARGED   FROM   FLANK/REAR
• Is   allowed   to   get   a   free   turn   if   you   are   prepared   to   take   the   risk,   but   
troops   so   doing   are   considered   to   have done   a   shooting   action   and   cannot   shoot   in   the   shooting   phase   (they   just   had   no   real   target)

[/i][/b]

So now I ask my simple question : how should it be played. Was there a clarification I did not find ?