Position of the General and measuring distances.

[AjojMajoj]

Normally, when a general is with a UG his base touches the rearmost base of the unit. But there are many situations, where the general's base doesn't fit in this place, so he sort of "jumps" around the unit, to allow maneuvers - sometimes he "moves" in this way by several BW.
Moreover - when fighting in combat - general is considered to be in the first rank (but obviously his base is still somewhere else).

How should command range be measured:
1) From the actual position of the base.
2) From the place "behind" the UG.
3) From the front rank when in combat.


And what about the base size - do big bases give larger command ranges?

[nikgaukroger]

Measure from where the base actually is.

[mark hargrave]

Hmm, Another rule I have been playing wrong, I took it saying he/she is "with the file" to mean within the file and therefore measure anywhere from the file. 

I guess that would then make round bases materially worse than square bases

[lionheartrjc]

I guess that would then make round bases materially worse than square bases

I am not sure it does.  A square base should retain the same orientation relative to the table edge, so if the general is on a round 40mm base it shouldn't make any difference in moving the general.
It does make a small difference for influencing prompting through fire, KaB tests etc, but I would always allow measuring from a hypothetical square base.

I must admit I have come across players who are far too casual about measuring the distance when moving their generals.

Richard

[LawrenceG]

  A square base should retain the same orientation relative to the table edge

Richard

so if he is with an UG and the UG wheels, the general does not rotate with the UG?

[lionheartrjc]

  A square base should retain the same orientation relative to the table edge

Richard

so if he is with an UG and the UG wheels, the general does not rotate with the UG?

Of course not.  I meant when a general was moving on his own and for measuring the maximum move!

Richard

[mark hargrave]

i was thinking more in terms of control




In this picture for the square general the blue unit is within 3BW, but not when using the round base, assuming my understanding of the rues is correct, (which is a big assumption)

[LawrenceG]

  A square base should retain the same orientation relative to the table edge

Richard

so if he is with an UG and the UG wheels, the general does not rotate with the UG?

Of course not.  I meant when a general was moving on his own and for measuring the maximum move!

Richard

OK. If a general moves to an UG that has a different orientation, does he simply need to touch it and then any additional movement needed to conform is free, or does it have to be measured as part of his move?

[lionheartrjc]

i was thinking more in terms of control




In this picture for the square general the blue unit is within 3BW, but not when using the round base, assuming my understanding of the rues is correct, (which is a big assumption)

Indeed, this clearly makes a difference.

[AlecJH]

I guess that would then make round bases materially worse than square bases

I must admit I have come across players who are far too casual about measuring the distance when moving their generals.

Richard

I think part of the reason players are too casual may be due to the paucity of rules on how generals are moved and how UGs are joined. I recall the first MeG game I had, my opponent and I searched for ages to try and find any guidance in the rulebook on how they are moved or how far, where command distances are measured from etc. The only thing we found on movement is in the QRS at the foot of the Maximum Movement Distances chart which states they "move as skirmish cavalry or may also move with an UG they are with". Strictly if they move as skirmish cavalry that would mean they can only interpenetrate as would a skirmish cavalry base and would be restricted in wheeling, turning, falling back as a skirmish cavalry base would. We decided that that couldn't be right (I hope!) and that, assuming generals were just a small number of men consisting of the man himself plus a few aides, they just interpenetrated and moved in any direction as they desired.

One thing that comes up frequently is exactly how does a general join an UG? If their move gets them in touching range of an UG bit not quite enough to conform i.e. it is say 5.75 base widths to an UG and would be 6.25 base widths to be properly lined up with the rear or front of a file, is that good enough for them to be considered to have joined that UG?

[lionheartrjc]

OK. If a general moves to an UG that has a different orientation, does he simply need to touch it and then any additional movement needed to conform is free, or does it have to be measured as part of his move?

The rules say that a general is either "with a file" or "standing alone" (page 78).  The second bullet on page 79 implies there are only two possible positions a) front of the file b) rear of the file. 

How would you define a move to end up "with a file"?
1. The general is touching the file front or back edge only.
2. The general is touching any file edge including the side of the file.

a. Touching the file edge to edge and corner to corner (clearly not possible with round files).
b. Touching the file (this could include corner to edge, corner to corner or edge to edge).

I play 1a.   

Richard

[LawrenceG]

OK. If a general moves to an UG that has a different orientation, does he simply need to touch it and then any additional movement needed to conform is free, or does it have to be measured as part of his move?

The rules say that a general is either "with a file" or "standing alone" (page 78).  The second bullet on page 79 implies there are only two possible positions a) front of the file b) rear of the file. 

How would you define a move to end up "with a file"?
1. The general is touching the file front or back edge only.
2. The general is touching any file edge including the side of the file.

a. Touching the file edge to edge and corner to corner (clearly not possible with round files).
b. Touching the file (this could include corner to edge, corner to corner or edge to edge).

I play 1a.   

Richard

That implies that generals on round bases can't be with a file, they can only stand alone. Is that really how you play?

[lionheartrjc]

That implies that generals on round bases can't be with a file, they can only stand alone. Is that really how you play?

I don't play with round generals.  I was referring to how I play.  I don't worry how my opponent plays their generals, that is for their conscience.
If given round generals orientation is not really an issue, if with a file I would allow them to measure the distance of their influence from the edge of the file that they are in contact with as well as from the general's base.  It is a game!

Richard

[Hunter]

I agree 100% and I think "as if" is how most (all?) of us would play it. MEG is a very broad church of like minded individuals where competitive FUN is the name of the game.

[mark hargrave]

Thanks Richard, great approach and makes sense,