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Author Topic: Shooting queries  (Read 232 times)

AlecJH

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Shooting queries
« on: February 19, 2021, 10:15:42 AM »
Two points arose from our game yesterday in respect of shooting:

1. In respect of the armour upgrade modifier the rules state "Any except artillery, shooting at unprotected TUG or unprotected SUG at less than or equal to 1BW". Our uncertainty revolved around whether the "less than or equal to 1BW" restriction applied to both unprotected TUGs and SUGs or just SUGs? We applied the latter which meant that the bow armed skirmishers facing unprotected bow armed TUGs immediately began to outshoot the TUGs they were facing being beyond 1BW.

2. Arc of fire. The usual rule for non-artillery shooting at greater than 1BW is a target within a 1BW of directly ahead. In the glossary "Within..... XXX" is defined as "At that distance or nearer". So if you have, for example, a shooting file facing 5 enemy files in line (for example's sake numbered 1 to 5 from one end to the other) and it is opposite number 3 -the centre enemy file (at greater than 1BW) which enemy files are in arc? Numbers 2, 3 & 4 are all within 1BW but are numbers 1 & 5? Strictly per the glossary as those files' side edges are "at that distance" do they qualify as targets and if not why not?

lionheartrjc

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Re: Shooting queries
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2021, 01:00:15 PM »
1. Just SuGs.

2.  No. I think this causes a lot of confusion but there isn't really a better way of defining it.  One possible way of thinking about it is that the gap between element 3 and 1 (or 5) is 1BW.  "At that distance" refers to the gap. So element 1 is >1BW from element 3. 

FrancisSmall

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Re: Shooting queries
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2021, 05:51:16 AM »
2.  No. I think this causes a lot of confusion but there isn't really a better way of defining it.  One possible way of thinking about it is that the gap between element 3 and 1 (or 5) is 1BW.  "At that distance" refers to the gap. So element 1 is >1BW from element 3. 

I will disagree with this. The distance between files 1 & 3 must be 1 BW and not "1 BW + 1 iota". Likewise, files 1 and 5 can be nothing other than exactly 1 BW from straight ahead of the red unit (given the setup shown below), and as the rules are written, red can fire at any of the five files. That may not be how the game is played, but that's what the rule says.

If you don't want red to fire at 1 & 5, then the rule should simply define the arc of fire as "less than 1 BW" and not "within a BW".





steads

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Re: Shooting queries
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2021, 08:45:27 AM »
On a practical note lining up to the pico-meter is probably physically impossible even with precision cut metal bases. Therefore the arc will practically be either bases 1-4 or 2-5 are in. KISS

daveparish

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Re: Shooting queries
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2021, 09:46:06 AM »
I've just been reading a popular book on quantum physics (by Carlo Rovelli) and apparently space isn't infinitely divisible, it comes in quanta. The smallest possible measurement is 10-66cm2 - you can't get smaller than this because that is the size of one quantum of space (why this is given as an area rather than a volume or a length I still have no idea, maybe that's in the next chapter). I have seen players in competition measure down to this level of precision when they want to say an enemy's charge can't reach their troops

Kokor Hekkus

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Re: Shooting queries
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2021, 12:21:01 PM »
Remind me to bring a set of slip guages to the next tournament, then I can measure to microns

lionheartrjc

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Re: Shooting queries
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2021, 03:40:42 PM »
Get a bit of realism here guys.  It is perfectly possible to be lined up, if you are in melee and break off then you will be lined up (and so on).   Also note that bases are not perfect, so could be 40.01 mm or 39.99 mm and nobody is going to notice.

My point is that if two opposing forces appear to be lined up, then I would only allow an arc from 2-4.  If they are not lined up then the arc will be either 1-4 or 2-5.  At no point is the arc going to be 1-5, that is clearly not the intention of the rule.

Good luck to the next player who quotes quantum mechanics at me the next time I am making an umpiring decision!  As Terry Pratchett pointed out, a cat (Greebo) in a sealed box might be alive or dead, but the most likely outcome is that it will be bloody furious! 

Richard

daveparish

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Re: Shooting queries
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2021, 04:41:01 PM »
Good luck to the next player who quotes quantum mechanics at me the next time I am making an umpiring decision!  As Terry Pratchett pointed out, a cat (Greebo) in a sealed box might be alive or dead, but the most likely outcome is that it will be bloody furious!


 :) :) :)

(Terry Pratchett definitely one of my heroes!)

FrancisSmall

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Re: Shooting queries
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2021, 08:12:45 PM »
Quote
Ahh, but the arc of fire that's... that's where I had them. They laughed at me and made jokes but I proved beyond the shadow of a doubt and with... geometric logic...
(Apologies to The Caine Mutiny)

I think the rules as written support firing at files 1-5, but I'll accept 2-4 as the intent, even as I mutter under my breath and rub my two ball bearings together.  :-X
« Last Edit: February 23, 2021, 08:28:31 PM by FrancisSmall »