A situation occurred in a recent game which lead to a lot of discussion.
The situation was a 'flank attack' (almost) exactly as that on page 141. A TUG of Gaul were engaged in melee (green uni) and were charged in flank by a Roman legion (red unit), and Gallic cavalry charged the Roman legion (orange unit).
The Roman player (who had the pack) claimed a flank attack - and discussion ensued - and eventually we referred to page 141. The Roman player argued that it was his pack, and he opted to do the flank attack first seeking to claim the +4 for flank attack. After discussion, and as the Gallic cavalry had 2 bases in contact with the outermost Roman base - the Gallic player (note not his turn) opted to fight his left hand cavalry base against Roman base seeking the flank bonus. Hence, the two Gallic cavalry both fought Roman legion bases - thereby protecting the flank of the Gallic infantry. First question: was this correct ? Second question : we concluded that it was irrelevant whose turn it was - the situation determined which bases 'faced off' ... correct ?
The third and final question: what what have been the result if the Roman legion (red unit) was 3 bases wide whilst the Gallic cavalry (orange unit) were only 2 bases wide ? My interpretation would be that the Roman player could choose to fight the two outer bases against the two cavalry bases - leaving the inner base as a flank attack on the Gallic infantry ? Is this correct ? and if so is the flank protection system broken ?
thanks
This question could do with a picture or illustration I suspect.
However, I will venture the following as you say the situation was very close to the diagram in the rules.
Who is the active player is relevant in that in a given melee they get to choose which file fights first. However, if that file is in contact with 2 enemy bases who could fight thyen the player who owns the 2 bases gets to choose which of those fights.
So if I read you question correctly you did get it right.
For your third question how that panned out would depend on which files to fight each player chose I think - remember you choose the file to fight alternately so it is quite possible that the Gallic player in this case could have chosen the file where they had 2 bases in contact whilst still having the choice of which of their 2 bases to fight with.
Sorry Nik, was being lazy in not explaining fully. The Roman legion making the flank attack was 2 bases wide, and the gallic cavalry providing flank protection was also 2 bases wide - exactly as per the diagram quoted above (pg 141). The explanation in the rules served as guidance to resolve the situation.
I question whether this rule would have worked if the Roman legion was 3 bases wide - ie more than the defending cavalry unit which was only 2 bases wide. This would mean that both the gallic cavalry and the roman legion could apply the 2-base in contact rule. As it was the Roman 'turn' they could force the gallic cavalry to fight the outermost Roman base; which I think means the other gallic cavalry to fight the central roman base - meaning the innermost Roman base does indeed get a flank attack on the gallic infantry. Please tell me I 'm missing something - else it seems the flank protection rule might be 'broken'
Please please explain why this is wrong !
I think you may well be right in this situation - the Romans have committed enough troops to overwhelm the Gauls and gain an advantage; lesson is to make sure you get your flank protection right ...
IMO the safest way to ensure a flank protection (other than not letting the enemy get into position to deliver one) is to deny the 1bw x 1BW space, anything else can be risky.
Can you create and picture and tell me who is active.
All sounds correct but hard to be sure.
Si
Si - use the diagram on page 141 (beats anything I could do) - then increase the red unit (the unit making the flank charge) to three bases wide ..... the attacking player is that controlling the red unit ..... now follow/play the sequence.
Ok got you. A fine question on a detail. If I get you right I think its ....
So Roman picks the right hand fight. Which takes out the right hand orange dice roll.
The orange then picks the left hand one and the Roman picks the middle one of his.
The left hand roman fight the Gauls but doesn't count flank bonus due to the 1BW square rule.
So creates 3 frontal combats.
Si
Quote from: Simon Meg-Meister on August 05, 2020, 04:13:52 PM
Ok got you. A fine question on a detail. If I get you right I think its ....
So Roman picks the right hand fight. Which takes out the right hand orange dice roll.
The orange then picks the left hand one and the Roman picks the middle one of his.
The left hand roman fight the Gauls but doesn't count flank bonus due to the 1BW square rule.
So creates 3 frontal combats.
Si
True if orange were in that position when the Romans charged, however, if they only reached it after the Romans have charged (implied by the original question) there will be a flank attack I believe. The Gauls will have cocked up their flank protection. (By coincidence this point is covered in the last rules clarry email I sent you ;D )
Yes I didn't notice that bit was responding the the specific just above.
Si
Fwiw - think Nik has got it right - the gallic cavalry charged to protect the flank, and were only two bases wide, hence the 1BW flank protection should not apply and the Romans get the flank attack. Phew .... thanks guys. Unless this needs a clarification - believe we can now close this one. Thanks for the understanding
I think there will be a small clarification to clear up a minor point.
I have added that the 1BW exclusion zone applies at the time chargers are moved.
S